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Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2015.12.27 05:14:49 -
[1] - Quote
Pravius wrote:the economy has become so out of wack the game has become too risk adverse and people are much less willing to fight due to huge cost of ships and mods.....
as far as new players are concerned i think 2 things have destroyed eves ability to bring in new players..... 1st suicide ganking in empire(have done this plenty myself) but still think it needs to go #1 reason why new players go MEH im done..
I'm not a "long term" player (or whatever). I played EVE for about a year back in 2012. I loved it. I was intrigued, but life got in the way & couldn't play again until just a few days ago when I got CCP Christmas sale email. So I renewed my account. I read up on the changes.
I'm a trader & a miner. I enjoy producing. I make your guns, your drones & your ammo. I mine & refine & run blueprints. That's what I enjoy doing. I even enjoy the thrill of slipping into low-sec to find a little Jasper.
But tonight I got suicide ganked. In hi-sec. And then podded too. I had no chance to run or hide or defend my Retriever. Total fly by. And then harassed by eve - mail. Demanding 10 Million ISK to keep them from ganking me again.
I quoted your post to say that for me, those two points are related. The economy may be out of whack, because of the ganking.
What will you gank when all the producers are gone? It's a game based on free will, I get that. An occasional gank is one thing. But these guys' sole purpose in the game is to destroy & disrupt producers. It's a game based on free will & producers will choose to stop producing when it no longer benefits them to do so.
I made guns, ammo & catalyst ships. I was literally destroyed by my client base. Why would I continue to produce for these guys? I've only been back a short time & already thinking "meh". Not the game I played in 2012.
Want to stop suicide ganking? Give producers a way to fight back? Allow me to choose who I sell to. Let me put corps like the one that ganked me tonight on a "no buy" list. I wonder how long they would last when their victims cut off their supply.
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Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2015.12.27 14:15:02 -
[2] - Quote
So, to sum up, nobody needs or likes hi-sec miners. If newbies loose a week or months worth of work because a ganker thought it'd be fun or cool to pop a sitting duck (which is what a barge is for a catalyst), it's the newbies fault for being weak & if they don't want to join pvp, you guys don't want them here anyway.
Good to know.
One thing I'm curious about, how is suicide ganking in hi-sec at all profitable? It seems to be about destruction of property, not gains. Can someone please explain how blowing yourself up is profitable? |
Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2015.12.27 14:42:09 -
[3] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:Cam Me'Leone wrote:So, to sum up, nobody needs or likes hi-sec miners. That's a sweeping generalization that is inherently incorrect.
"The biggest producers are in nulsec. I would still have ships to fly even if every last highsec miner left the game overnight."
That's what I'm getting from these responses. That's what I'm getting from the gankers. Hi-sec mining is a waste of time & older players who have more ISK than CCP can produce will continue to shoot them like fish in a barrel until they give it up. |
Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2015.12.27 15:03:22 -
[4] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:Mallak Azaria wrote:Gregor Parud wrote:Miners can do JUST fine and in fact, ganking is GOOD for miners because it takes care of the afk (semi) botters meaning that active miners who pay attention and are actual real normal players get more isk for their ores. Ganking is only bad for non-effort idiots, it's good for everyone else. That sounds like something you may have read on a certain blog about bumping & such. In reality destruction is good because the economy revolves around it, it really is that simple. This. If ships aren't blowing up, no one is going to buy new ones. If no one is buying them, no one builds them. If no one is building them, then no one is buying the ore you're mining or the minerals you're refining. When you say, "without highsec miners, you'd have no ships", you have to remember that without people getting blown up, you'd have no market.
Ships get blown up in low-sec & incursion points all the time. I don't need gankers as clients. Just like they can get everything they need from their null sec buddies. I get it. Hi-sec mining is a waste of time. |
Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2015.12.27 15:23:13 -
[5] - Quote
sero Hita wrote:Cam Me'Leone wrote:So, to sum up, nobody needs or likes hi-sec miners. If newbies loose a week or months worth of work because a ganker thought it'd be fun or cool to pop a sitting duck (which is what a barge is for a catalyst), it's the newbies fault for being weak & if they don't want to join pvp, you guys don't want them here anyway.
Good to know.
One thing I'm curious about, how is suicide ganking in hi-sec at all profitable? It seems to be about destruction of property, not gains. Can someone please explain how blowing yourself up is profitable? I think it is a certain kind of miner, that people dislike. Because being ganked is largely avoidable. I know because I sometimes mine in lowsec(crazyyyy, I know!!), and have only lost one procurer due to a mistake on my behalf (Don't get entangled in the asteroids :D). Questions I have to your statement are: - Why was that miner caught by the catalyst? The D-scan would have told the miner the catalyst was coming. And as the miner was pre-aligned with a higgs rig(to decrease speed and get more time aligned), he could just warp out as the ganker landed. Why didn't he? -Why did a barge die to a catalyst? A fully tanked procurer can handle more catalysts without breaking a sweat. Or did the miner fly an untanked mackinaw to increase yield? - Why did the miner not find a quiet system to mine, so he could watch local in case a player named something like #IGANKnoobNOAAWWW jumps into the system? To your point about profitability of ganking. With mining ships it is not to earn anything, but more a statement from certain players, that they don't want you to be AFK when mining. Because if you are checking what is going on around you, you will hardly never be ganked.
The most useful response I've gotten. Thank you.
To your point, I wasn't aware I needed to treat mining in hi-sec the same as mining in low-sec. Things have changed a lot in 3 years. |
Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2015.12.27 15:32:48 -
[6] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:Cam Me'Leone wrote: Ships get blown up in low-sec & incursion points all the time. I don't need gankers as clients. Just like they can get everything they need from their null sec buddies. I get it. Hi-sec mining is a waste of time.
Gankers destroy trillions more than they lose. The gankers aren't your clients. Their victims are. Cam Me'Leone wrote: The most useful response I've gotten. Thank you.
To your point, I wasn't aware I needed to treat mining in hi-sec the same as mining in low-sec. Things have changed a lot in 3 years.
No they haven't, high sec has never been safe. Just because you haven't caught onto that in three years doesn't mean anything has changed.
Nope. New players can't afford to build barges. We can scarcely afford to buy them. |
Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2015.12.27 16:19:23 -
[7] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:
You're not new, you've been here three years apparently.
Just to clarify this point, I started playing in 2012 & haven't played for about 3 years. So I have a little less than a year of play time, most of which was in 2012. Back then I don't recall there being entire corps dedicated to ganking & extorting hi-sec miners.
Also the "if you had bothered to research it" argument is not a great one. As is apparent in these comments, there is a different answer from everyone you ask. There is no way to decipher who is full of crap and who isn't and it's all opinion anyway. |
Cam Me'Leone
The Scope Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2015.12.27 18:56:27 -
[8] - Quote
I think I have the answers I was looking for.
I'm a casual player. I can scrounge together about 5 hours a week (30-60 minutes at a time) to myself. That's my time. It will take 2-3 months for me to recoup my losses. During which time I'm likely to get ganked again. It's a never ending spiral down to bankruptcy. For no other reason than someone wants to feel good about being able to hinder someone else.
I thought EVE was a game I could play a little at a time. Unlike other online games where I might need 2 hours of uninterrupted time to run a mission.
I also thought it would be the kind of game where I could mind my own business and not be bothered or go in for something more (like pvp) when I have the time. If I was a big PVP guy with unlimited time to play, I'd buy a PS4.
The gankers are pretty clear that they believe EVE would be "better" without players like me.
I posted here to see if that was a minority opinion or a prevailing one. The prevailing opinion seems to be "if you walk down the street in New Eden in broad daylight without a gun on your hip; you should expect to get mugged" PVP is a requirement; a fact of life. That's fine if that's the answer. I'm not here to try and change anyone's opinion.
I posted my questions in this thread because it's about subscriptions. CCP clearly wants old players to come back (or else I wouldn't have gotten 3 months of play time for $10). I can't speak for "everyone". But I can speak for myself and other casual players like me. We are not welcome in EVE. There is no way to avoid the noids. EVE is not the game I am looking for. |
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